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13/05/2013 at 07:39
So after my post about P and her breathing yesterday, we've had another awful night.
P bfed at 8pm but didnt really finish as she fell asleep and i couldnt wake her. Topped her up with formula at 9pm and went to bed at 9.30. She shuffled, grunted and squeaked till 11 and finally fell asleep. Then woke for food at 11.30. She had bfeed and formula. Put her down at 12.30 when she was grunting etc for another hour so i got up and rocked her etc but she was wide awake. She eventually nodded off about 2 then woke again at 3 and the same thing all over again. She isnt bfing properly - she will feed for 10 mins one side then fall asleep and you just cant wake her. Or she gives a few sucks just to go to sleep but isnt really feeding. She woke again at 5.30 screaming and the only thing that stopped her was to bf her but she is really just using me like a dummy to get to sleep and that coupled with the hour lobg grunting sessions is killing me. I reckon over the last 3 nights i have had about 5 hours sleep. My boobs are sore where she isnt feeding properly and i feel like giving up on bfing just so i can rest. I know that sounds totally selfish but i am running on empty. I am crying ALL the time and already dreading next week when H goes back to work. I keep snapping at G because i am so tired which isnt fair on her - she is only 4 and such a good girl. I feel like all this is affecting my close relationship with her.
I just dont know what to do. P doesnt seem to settle in the crib at all but will fall asleep other places no problem. She chokes a lot on milk too so not sure whats going on there?
Sorry for the ramble. Just had to get it out.
13/05/2013 at 08:29
She is still so tiny...I know not what you want to hear but imo 5hr sleep is good going. Can't advise on bf as O couldn't latch full stop, but if it really is getting you that down and you want to stop I would. It doesn't sound like its doing your mental wellbeing any good. However you are still likely in the baby blues stage too x
13/05/2013 at 08:31
I'm offering a huge hug. The newborn days are an absolute killer.
I'm not got any bf experience but why do you feel giving up will help? (I don't mean that harsh, what I mean is, do you think that she will be less hungry on formula? Or do you need the support of someone else being able to feed?). Team former is a myth I'm afraid.
Also, and again I don't know how to phrase this without it sounding mean, but 2 night feeds is brilliant at Ps age. I'd concentrate on the settling in between more than the food. I know they don't recommend giving dummies right away to BF babies but also know some moms have to no ill effects. Could this be an option? I know I commented on the other thread about the grunts but it really is normal. E did it all night last night. (Yawn). Have you checked the room temperature? E grunts even more if cold? Where are you putting P down to sleep? What have you done there to encourage her to settle? Would you consider Co sleeping? It was never for me but again lots of my tri buddies did it successfully to get sleep.
Finally, remember you could be approaching the 3 weeks GS which always did to E as you described.. just unable to settle.
Again huge hugs a sympathy from me x
13/05/2013 at 08:34
Give the breast feeding helpline a call for a chat, it make help you feel better or may help you decide to stop. You have to do what's right for your family as a whole. Could you express some so you know she is still getting some of your milk as well as formula. What is G doing today, could you have a day with just you and P to snuggle, feed and nap as needed without feeling bad ? Big hugs x
13/05/2013 at 08:37
P sounds a lot like A in the early days. He was really unsettled and a grunter. The grunting eased once we got him to a cranial osteopath. I don't remember exactly what she did but he was a new baby after a couple of sessions with her. Remind me, did you have a CS? I'm sure it was related to that and not being pushed through the birth canal. Have you tried infacol or gripe water in case she s colicky.
I never successfully breastfed so not the best to answer but managed about 11 weeks with A. My coping mechanism for those night feeds was to give expressed milk in a bottle. I know that's not recommended in terms of establishing milk but I knew I was getting a decent feed into him then.
There will be others along with much better advice soon I'm sure xxx
13/05/2013 at 08:56
Coco its about 5hrs sleep over all 3 days i have had i reckon. If only it were 5 hours for each night! I am averaging about 2 hrs a night at the moment.
LM i am just finding bfing so hard as a) she isnt feeding properly from me some of the time - just more like a dummy, b) only i can feed her which coupled with me not getting more than 2 hours sleep a night is killing me, c) i am still having to go down to make up formula as she is still hungry after bfing. If it werent for this hour of not settling i wouldnt be considering not bfing tbh. Havent got any issues with frequency of feeds - goes with the territory with newborns, its the not sleeping in vetween. With formula H and i can take it in turns to get up. I rock her or bf her till she is asleep then put her down and tuck her in in her crib. She sleeps soundly for say 5 mins then the shuffling etc starts. I let her do her thing for a while then we are back to the rocking etc and the cycle goes round and round of her nodding off, sleeping for 5 mins then waking again. I have considered a dummy but so many friends have said we will be up and down all night plugging it back in as she is too tiny to find it herself. Not keen on the co sleeping route but have to say i am getting desperate.
Birdie G is at my chikdminders today. I asked if she could go there for a day of playing with her friends as quite frankly i am not a fun mummy at the moment which breaks my heart so yes i intend to try and get a bit of sleep in if i csn.
Morph yes i had a cs. Perhaps i should take her to see my osteopath.
I know this will get better with time and i am sleep deprived at the moment. I hate feeling this way. I never quit at anything and this is so important. I am so tired i nag at H and G all the time and it broke my heart yesterday when G told me i was a grumpy mummy. I miss our fun. I look at P and i love her so much but i feel like i dont know how to help her. I thought all this would be easier second time round but i feel totally useless.
13/05/2013 at 09:08
Have a hug MM, it is really difficult. Can you get along to see a bf advisor/get a bf expert HV to come visit you to help you with feeding? x
Huge hugs lovely, the sleep deprivation is so tough. Could it be an early growth spurt? I found KellyMom website really useful and the link Hepburn posted a while back called timeline of a breastfed baby. Just let's you know how hard it is and how normal it all is. Definitely consider co sleeping. A slept when cosleeping but wouldn't sleep in his crib till 4 weeks. Do you swaddle her? Try a relaxing bath before bed? 10 minutes is ok for a feed, A only fed for 5-15 mins each time...little and often. He's stretching out his feeds now, it takes time and at the time its bloody hard (still is but improving). She may be the same with formula, little and often and then you will be up making bottles in the night. Try slumber bear/Ewan sheep too. Also, don't let her keep feeding if it hurts as otherwise you'll be too sore...re latch till it feels comfy. Finally be kind to yourself, the newborn days are exhausting. Im on fb group if you want to.chat/vent xxx
13/05/2013 at 09:15
Get her in bed with you. It is the ony way I survived until 12 weeks when he finally improved and could lay flat in his cot. I got about 1-2 hours a night in those first few weeks at home, it really impacts negatively on everything. As soon as he was in bed with me propped in the crook of my arm we all slept. The difference it makes is unreal
13/05/2013 at 09:21
Aw I feel for you. I totally know what you mean about having someone to share the load as that was my "look on the bright side" when I failed to BF, however, and again this sounds like I'm being harsh but how often will your h get up to feed when he's back at work... In my experience, hardly ever! Though obviously each man is different. I'd honestly concentrate on the settling. Because even if you switch to formula this will still be an issue.
I do agree about the dummy. I have to put Es in maybe twice or three times a night. But when it meant I got 6 hours sleep instead of 2, those 40 seconds putting it back in were well spent. I say this.. But i bloody hate the dummy, it's swings and roundabouts I guess.
Have you tried things to encourage the settling? A slumber bear? Mobile? Swaddling? There is so much and it's a battle of finding what's right for each baby. Lots of people say warm the sheets with a water bottle while you fees to sleep so they don't notice the move though I've not tried it.
13/05/2013 at 10:25
Have you seen a BF counsellor? If she's not feeding properly then I think that's what you need to address. E was very similar in that she would feed for maybe five minutes and fall asleep so I couldn't offer the other side. Turns out she had a posterior tongue tie. Feeding was so exhausting for her she was falling asleep before she was full. Then waking up soon after for more. If you haven't already, I would get her checked for TT. It's so easily sorted if she does have it and could make the world of difference. Big hug, newborns are hard X
13/05/2013 at 10:31
It sounds like you need a BF Counsellor. Has she been checked for tongue tie by a specialist? Not just a MW?
It sounds as though there is either an issue getting the milk out or something uncomfy once she's drunk the milk.
If you are wanting to continue BFing then you need to see a BFC or Lactation Consultant. Does your hospital have a drop in clinic? Would you consider paying for someone private to come to you?
Please don't give up. If you can get the BFing sorted it'll be SO much easier I promise x
13/05/2013 at 10:40
Have you tried a dummy? (if you're happy for her to have one) I think only you know if you want to give up BF'ing but like others have said, worth checking first with a BFC. Have a massive (hug) sleep deprivation is a b*tch.
13/05/2013 at 12:53
Definitely see a BFC but also remember that the hormones in your milk makes them sleepy so its annoying but normal that this is what is happening. Plus are you sure she's not feeding when she seems she's asleep - has she unlatched - if she's still sucking then this can be part of building up your milk supply. But my midwife showed my how to unlatch a baby safely by pushing on their chin so that they come off without hurting you. You can offer a finger to see if they are content just to suck or actually want to get something out.
Can your H take the baby for a bit at night if she's unsettled but not feeding? Just so you can get some sleep.
And try the dummy as well.
This is all normal behaviour its just so knackering for you. But it will get easier you just have to remember that.
13/05/2013 at 14:02
Well i fed P at 7.30 and H took her and let me sleep for a couple of hours. I have eaten and showered and feel vaguely human. Trying a few new tactics tonight. The crib seems to be the only place she has trouble settling so trying a moses basket tonight which we usually just use downstairs. Also getting some infacol in case its wind related. When i was sleeping i put P's blanket in bed with me in the hope that if she can smell me she might settle easier. We shall see.
Thank you all for listening to me x
13/05/2013 at 14:50
Have you tried co sleeping? I did this for 2 weeks until Iris started liking the hammock.
Glad you got some sleep and a shower, it really helps if you sleep when you can.
Infacol is good stuff, I use it for Iris.
My suggestion would be to let her latch and suck in her sleep as I know Miss Iris still swallows milk even if she's asleep but that's hard if you have sore nips. How much formula are you giving in each bottle? Can't remember the OP but have you tried stripping down to her nappy and tickling her feet to rouse her then offering the other breast instead of formula?
13/05/2013 at 15:41
I try everything to wake her up - toe tickling, stripping off, blowing on her, playing with her ears and nothing. She always has both boobs before formula and she takes 1-2oz bottle.
13/05/2013 at 15:58
Is there anyone else who can help you out? The only way we got through the constant feeding was by getting my mum or my H to take A through to the living room between feeds, so I could get some sleep. It meant that instead of me spending an hour settling him, only to get up again an hour later to feed, I was getting sleep in 2 hr blocks. You'd be amazed at the difference it makes!!
Don't let her latch hurt you. That was how I ended up with infections in my nipples, and in hospital with mastitis. It's took us till 9 weeks to repair the damage. CP recommended the deep latch technique to help with feeding. Search 'flipple technique' on You Tube. It is literally the only thing that has allowed us to continue breastfeeding.
13/05/2013 at 17:31
No we dont have anyone else nearby but H has been taking P downstairs in the morning so i can sleep. I am just going to have to get on with it next week though when H is at work.
13/05/2013 at 20:43
Glad you got some sleep. But if your H is off this week wake him up in the middle of the night. It sounds mean but getting sleep at night will make a difference. I think I spent one night sitting with my daughter in the moses basket amd shushing all night trying to persuade her to sleep in it. We realised that my H had to help out at night which he did. Although we did get her mostly sleeping in it.
The early days are hard but they don't last forever and will pass.
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